View topic - Military withdrawal
Who's for and against military withdrawal and why?
(Whether regarding the wars in Afghanistan, Libya and so on, or the occupation of nations like Japan)
Reports and a close connection of mine with ISAF have found that civilians want troops out of there, while the troops themselves want to stay longer.
Should we force them out even though they want to stay?
Budgeting issues particularly in the US as it costs $2billion per week of operations in Afghanistan alone even though they are overlooking the same corruption they say they are trying to prevent.
Edit: This a comment made by an Afghan on the situation as well:
"If the US cannot defeat the Taliban with 150000 troops + money + contractors + thousands of Afghan troops, then how can they win without these numbers. Does not make sense at all unless uncle SAM (USA) has a secret magical weapon to win the war."
(Whether regarding the wars in Afghanistan, Libya and so on, or the occupation of nations like Japan)
Reports and a close connection of mine with ISAF have found that civilians want troops out of there, while the troops themselves want to stay longer.
Should we force them out even though they want to stay?
Budgeting issues particularly in the US as it costs $2billion per week of operations in Afghanistan alone even though they are overlooking the same corruption they say they are trying to prevent.
Edit: This a comment made by an Afghan on the situation as well:
"If the US cannot defeat the Taliban with 150000 troops + money + contractors + thousands of Afghan troops, then how can they win without these numbers. Does not make sense at all unless uncle SAM (USA) has a secret magical weapon to win the war."
QuoteLast edited by Thalassaemia on Tue Oct 18, 2011 2:45 am; edited 2 times in total
I'm not a fan of war. Then again, I don't think anybody is truly a "fan" of war. That being said, I think an early withdrawal will lead to numerous long-standing issues with countries we're at war with.
I'm not really educated on why we have an occupation zone in different countries, but I imagine it was originally for us to give aide to other country where aide is needed. I spoke with a friend stationed in Japan and I recall him momentarily mentioning that he was helping in some way with post-Tsunami clean-up or medical aide.
I guess my answer is that I'm against military withdrawal. I completely understand that other countries don't want our nation butting our nose in their business, and I completely support that mindset, I would probably feel the same way if I weren't an American, but I think in the instances where we're trying to supply aide to the commonfolk of the country, then it's completely necessary.
I'm not really educated on why we have an occupation zone in different countries, but I imagine it was originally for us to give aide to other country where aide is needed. I spoke with a friend stationed in Japan and I recall him momentarily mentioning that he was helping in some way with post-Tsunami clean-up or medical aide.
I guess my answer is that I'm against military withdrawal. I completely understand that other countries don't want our nation butting our nose in their business, and I completely support that mindset, I would probably feel the same way if I weren't an American, but I think in the instances where we're trying to supply aide to the commonfolk of the country, then it's completely necessary.
"Wintermute was hive mind, decision maker, effecting change in the world outside. Neuromancer was personality. Neuromancer was immortality."
I'm anti-war in general. I think we should never have gotten involved, but now that we're there, we have to accept that there is no way ALL of the troops are ever coming home. Look at Korea and Vietnam. We still have troops there.
If we withdraw too early, there's going to be hell to pay. But I'm also not terribly optimistic; we're probably going to "get ours" at some point in the near future regardless of when/how we withdraw troops.
And don't forget that many people in the countries where we've meddled don't want our help and don't like us. Don't even kid yourself thinking we were going over purely to help others--it was a political move made to prove a point. That we maybe helped some people is just an added "bonus." It's not our job to "save" other countries, especially when things in our own country are so fucked up.
If we withdraw too early, there's going to be hell to pay. But I'm also not terribly optimistic; we're probably going to "get ours" at some point in the near future regardless of when/how we withdraw troops.
And don't forget that many people in the countries where we've meddled don't want our help and don't like us. Don't even kid yourself thinking we were going over purely to help others--it was a political move made to prove a point. That we maybe helped some people is just an added "bonus." It's not our job to "save" other countries, especially when things in our own country are so fucked up.
I believe that once the people of a country wants an foreign military force out of there they should leave. Doing anything else is a form of hostility even if you do it with the best intentions.
Personally I think America has too much of its own shit to be dealing with. We have HUGE domestic problems right now; even if it wasn't costing us billions of dollars to be involved in overseas campaigns, we'd do better to bring our troops home and start cleaning house instead of marching around in other people's back yards.
Dark-Wish-Dreamer wrote:I believe that once the people of a country wants an foreign military force out of there they should leave. Doing anything else is a form of hostility even if you do it with the best intentions.
Some of the countries we're occupying probably didn't want a foreign military force there to begin with.
Sorry for sounding anti-American, and I know it's not really socially accepted to say something bad about America unless you're actually an American, but I think that the American government sticks their noses into every country where they're uncalled for. I don't believe that they're truly there to help but more for political reasons, as Grape said. Most of the time they want to have some stake in the country if they're going to go there to 'help', they're not doing it for nothing.
That said, I'm not saying that other countries aren't guilty of this kind of monopoly, but I just think that America throws their weight around more because they have more power to wield. Look what happened when the American economy fell... the whole world went into recession, now that's saying something.
That said, I'm not saying that other countries aren't guilty of this kind of monopoly, but I just think that America throws their weight around more because they have more power to wield. Look what happened when the American economy fell... the whole world went into recession, now that's saying something.
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I think at this point in time it would be best for everybody if we withdraw our troops in Iraq/Afghanistan. The U.S. should not be the world's police. We have no real reason to be there. And we quite frankly, we can't afford it.
Forcing someone to do something they don't want to do has never worked. Change works best when it comes from within.
And that is why we are not going to win this war. Because the people over there don't want change and don't want our help.
It also doesn't help that they are not educated/can't read and don't know what is going on in the world around them.
Forcing someone to do something they don't want to do has never worked. Change works best when it comes from within.
And that is why we are not going to win this war. Because the people over there don't want change and don't want our help.
It also doesn't help that they are not educated/can't read and don't know what is going on in the world around them.
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My Chemical Romance wrote:Look what happened when the American economy fell... the whole world went into recession, now that's saying something.
The world economy didn't fall because the American economy did. For the most part it was housing policies made globally that caused the eventual crash and burn for the most part, but it varies between countries. America's economy being a recession is just putting a huge hamper on other markets recovering, it didn't put them there in the first place.
But I fall away from the topic at hand.
Get them the hell out of there, they've been too long already and their presence is a double edged sword. They're creating the very terrorists they fight against with occupation. We've been asking for them out for years. I don't care what the soldiers do or don't want, you can't let people continue to die on flimsy pretense, period.
This is exactly why our economy collapsed, because no one seems to want to ask the ethical questions but are more concerned with what is more profitable. (And yes, war is profit. There's a ton of companies that produce weapons and equipment for the military that are all going to be laid off if we withdraw, the Republicans are correct on that point. War is profitable business and it's what in the end pulled us out of the Great Depression.)
We spend billions a week on a war to eradicate factions within a country because they present a largely imagined threat to us (I say imagined, because although Al-Queda and other middle-eastern terrorist factions are threats, so are terrorists in every. other. country. Make regulations to deal with the threat and GET OVER IT), we continue to hold an unwanted presence in countries primarily torn apart by US and not our enemies that are supposed to be their foes as well, all the while millions of people are killed by diseases and genocidal leaders in countries that don't have fossil fuels.
If that makes sense to you, even after looking past patriotism, congratulations, you are a proud recipient of the Human Rights Moron award.
Our military presence is too large, too expensive, and too largely pointless to warrant its continuance.
If that makes sense to you, even after looking past patriotism, congratulations, you are a proud recipient of the Human Rights Moron award.
Our military presence is too large, too expensive, and too largely pointless to warrant its continuance.
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I try to avoid watching the news because I get really irritated. But my boyfriend, a war vet, wants the troops out of the war. It's the reason why he never re-enrolled.
Personal opinion i'm not against war or for it. i admit i look at it from a bit of political and military aspects because that is what i get involved with. now on the idea that we are bad in every country we enter isn't a proper way to think either.
First of all for military reasons we can't forget 9/11 and all the people who died because of another countries actions. America was attacked first and so to put down those who striked first we go in to end what they started. now on another note once we bring our troops home we need to strengthen ourselves a bit further because many forget the U.S. is a world super power and many nations and countries look to us for action. yes many americans don't want that and many different people don't want that but the matter of the fact is for political reasons if we don't take action we get looked down on and if we take action we get looked down on. think of how many of more thousands would die if action wasnt taken. matter of the fact is we created the USA to be world super power and that is by our strength as a people that caused that not the military and not the government. yes we will get ours but as long as we are a super power and many peoples look to us for help as many detest our help we will keep getting involved. I admit id like to see our troops home but id also like to see this war ended once and for all.
First of all for military reasons we can't forget 9/11 and all the people who died because of another countries actions. America was attacked first and so to put down those who striked first we go in to end what they started. now on another note once we bring our troops home we need to strengthen ourselves a bit further because many forget the U.S. is a world super power and many nations and countries look to us for action. yes many americans don't want that and many different people don't want that but the matter of the fact is for political reasons if we don't take action we get looked down on and if we take action we get looked down on. think of how many of more thousands would die if action wasnt taken. matter of the fact is we created the USA to be world super power and that is by our strength as a people that caused that not the military and not the government. yes we will get ours but as long as we are a super power and many peoples look to us for help as many detest our help we will keep getting involved. I admit id like to see our troops home but id also like to see this war ended once and for all.
We're in countries like Japan because we have an open trade agreement with them. They're one of our allies. Now, I agree with the withdrawal from the Middle East because the big wigs in DC have no reason to keep us there and, to be honest, I'm tired of going over every 6 months and getting shot at. D:
